Norms Restoration - 31 Seater Projects

1952 AEC Regal III [2547]

2017

December Body

Norman Julian 3 Dec
I'm getting close to finishing these small fiddly jobs.
Because out of 5 of these air deflectors (that's what I call them it is just in front of the driver underneath on the inside so when you push open the window it diverts the breeze down towards the drivers legs and feet.
Unfortunately if it rains water can be diverted as well) I couldn't find one descent one so I had to make a new one from scratch.
This is one reason why this resto is going on for as long as it has.

Norman Julian
You can see it here in front of the steering wheel
Gregor Neil Robertson
The new deflector looks better finished than the original.
What metal have you used ?
I take it you’ve got folders and all the metal fabricator’s tools?
Have you an English wheel? Regarding timescale, after I retired formally (although I still work on in other fields) - I have 4 or 5 projects which I took aboard in my 40’s and 50’s optimistically thinking I’d have time and money -somehow - to complete them to a good standard.
Well it hasn’t happened. So each project staggers on - but never quite complete or perfect. Then a strange thing happened.
I stored my ‘46 Bedford Tipper M type in a unit last year which had a couple of guys sort of permanently attached to it - just doing odd jobs. Both seriously good mechanics.
So I bit on the bullet and employed them -completely informally - and my life savings (I’m 75 now) are draining. There won’t be enough for my funeral but by Jove, the Bedford’s looking great.
Who cares about what else is left over?
It looks like my 3 children have done better than me in money terms.
And the Bedford is now very saleable anyway - worth about £14000 GBP.
The other projects together about £15k.
My wife will have the house and the dog.
So that’s my life plan! I’d have loved to have done a bus - had a few opportunities - but not now, too late.
Norman Julian 3 Dec
Because I would like to think I will live forever but I can't I have given myself an optimistic time period for the 3 buses.
I reckon I still have about 12 to 18 months on the AEC Regal.
I have given myself about 4 to 5 years on the single decker Leyland and about 3 to 4 years on the TD5 d/decker.
The reason for so much more time on the single decker over the d/decker is because there is a lot more work to do on it.
Mind you I will know a lot more with the TD5 when I take the skin off but I did look under it and if I don't have to rip the old floor out and replace floor bearers and floor boards etc it will take months even years of the build.
I will be starting on the 2 Leylands when the shed is built so I will be working on all three together. This is the plan anyway.
David Wilson
most artists work 3-4 or more canvasses at once!
Jim Sharp
Sounds pretty easy. What are you going to do in your spare time
Norman Julian
Actually Jim I was thinking about taking up coaching the All Blacks and teaching them how to beat the Wallabies in union because everyone else can. Hehehehe.
Jim Sharp
Yea right lol
James Leonard Garrod
Forget about 'Coaching', Idiot and just get back 'On the Buses'!
Norman Julian 5th Dec
Moving along and examining some of the steel panels that are inside and all of them are substandard.
I keep hearing those words from a friend "you are wasting your time".
Looking at this I think not.
Trouble is when you start a restoration a particular way you have to keep going in that maner.
All these panels are to be replaced.








Carle Gregory
handy spares for the Leyland? or at least scraap money to offset cost for AEC/Leyland/Decker/Shed
Gregor Neil Robertson
You are the mother and father of all perfectionists
Norman Julian
Ha ha.
I wouldn't think so.
Gregor Neil
Robertson Norman Julian on the one to ten scale you score 9 - as close as anyone can realistically get to perfection.
Norman Julian 15 Dec
Took a few days on and off to get these panels fitting right.
Moving on now.
The new project has enspired me to go a little faster.
Norman Julian 15 Dec
This needs a new base.
Covered in Greece, oil and worn aluminium strips.
I wonder how this will come up.
In my humble opinion this is the centre piece of the whole interior.
If this isn't fussed over it doesn't matter about everything else.
Norman Julian
Yuk!
Greg Scott
A good polish norm will come up nice
Norman Julian
You did yours didn't you Greg Scott?
I thought you posted a picture of yours a while back.
David Wilson
I was told by a metal polisher once that you should paint the other side to seal the aluminium -which is a little bit porous.
Helps maintain the shine on the other side for longer.
Norman Julian
Good idea!
Charles Shipway
Norman I agree whole heartedly this cover is very eye catching in this style of interior
And I would make sure it was given a lot of attention the worn patches to me are war medals for service to the cause being an older bus
Greg Scott
i did norm but not to a high polish finish ! a lot more hours soaked up
Norman Julian 16 Dec
I started this job yesterday as you know and I will be taking my time and setting it aside from time to time to do other jobs.
I don't like to get bogged down.
Anyway, it is hard to see in this shot but I have been sanding flat the AEC lettering.
Over the years it has been dented and bits taken out as well as rounded edges.
I decided to sand most of the problems out with my orbital sander then finish it off with a medium sandpaper to see the effect.
I think I'm happy with it but I'll wait till it is finished before I decided whether to leave it without polishing it.


Norman Julian
A new one of these to be made.
I can get a strip the same.
Stuart Brown
Would look good with the recessed bit painted and the AEC polished..
Norman Julian
Stuart , If I did that everyone would have me alongside Jesus at Easter LOL
Stuart Brown
That's OK...
Norman Julian 16 Dec
Very pleased with how the coin tray turned out.
It was so bad I asked Scott Wilson if he had one.
Unfortunately they are hard to get even in ordinary condition.
I repaired this one and it turned out good.
No automatic alt text available.
Brian Musgrove
Like your storage bins in the background
Norman Julian
I have them all over my workshop Brian and they are all being used.
Gary Russell
You will need some authentic pre-dismal currency to set the scene
Norman Julian 16 Dec
Norman Julian
It had a lot of what looks like wire brush scratches in it.
That needed to be sanded out.
Norman Julian 17 Dec
This is the back door left side.
The hole is for the door actuator which is sitting on top of the wheel arch behind a passengers seat.
The timber as you can see was rotten and covered up by the side wall panel.





Greg Scott
Its good to see youre progress norm !
Whats really good for me is youre quite a few steps ahead of where i am at .
And i get some great ideas off yours !
Its also good to see the quality and progress of youre resto Two blokes building 1952 same bodied busses from the ground up in 2017 who would of thought. ?
Norman Julian
I knew I should have put a patent on it. LOL.
Norman Julian
No one would have thought that, Greg.
Greg Scott
Norman Julian to late ! lol
Norman Julian 23rd dec
Norman Julian
This panel had a hole in the bottom for the battery cables coming through but because I changed that the hole wasn't needed anymore.
Norman Julian 23rd dec
More panel replacing today.
4 in total.
Because as I said before the flooring was put down first then the panels, needless to say they were short putting them back on.
There is also the fact that most of them were rusted through as in photo.






Gregor Neil Robertson
Plus the fact that some (or all panels) were sheet steel ( what gauge?) and now you’re replacing everything with galvanised panels?
Are they any easier to cut?
What tools do you use guillotines or snips?
Both I guess.
And which brand do you use for riveting?
Not that I’m taking on a bus at my age, much as I’d like to.
There was a local chap Jason who was a bus fanatic here near Edinburgh who restored quite a few buses -at one point he ran classic bus tours for tourists in Edinburgh, I think it was successful -couple of years operating - but it got bought over then the buses disappeared and now these tours are big business like London using monster semi open top Volvos.
Which seem to run three quarters empty all year.
Can’t understand the economics of all that.
Doubt if the classic buses could have endured the grind of daily life in Edinburgh with it’s steep hills.
And start/stop traffic
Norman Julian
The materials I am using are the same thickness as was there which is 1.2mm.
They only used steel in most cases and not galvanised steel because the back of the sheets are rusty, especially where they never prepainted.
I don't use tin snips because it is too thick for them.
I cut them with an angle grinder then finish them off with a sander.
I don't possess a bender so I get it done where I get the steel from.
I do the aluminium bending by hand because most of the time they are shaped curved bends.
Originally I couldn't understand why they used a mixture of aluminium with steel but after a time I worked it out.
All the steel sheets are at the bottom.
I reckon it's because these panels came into contact with people more often then not and cop punishment from feet, etc, so they used steel for extra strength.
This of course is a guess.
Feral Pigeon
Norman Julian your overhaul of 2547 far exceeds an "A" overhaul at the DGT / PTC Chullora workshops overhaul. ��
Brian Blunt
Looking better than the original build
Catherine Norman
What I found with the panels on AEC Regal 3416 is the steel panels were in fact coated in galvanising solution but only in the exposed side as they didn't do the backs hence they rusted at the rear.
Likewise they didn't primer any panels rather just sanded and painted the top coats over the old this would have been due time constraints at Chullora and the need to get buses back into service.
I too was amazed at the mix of aluminium and steel panels proven when one of my guys placed a magnet on the panels
Norman Julian
Yeah! The same thing with the steel plate at the bottom of the jacknife doors.
I don't think the buses when new had the kick panels.
Must have been added sometime after.
Norman Julian 26th Dec
Norman Julian
To get the wheel arch frame back flush with the pillar I cut the frame on either side of the cross "L " shaped steel piece and used the clamp to push it in.
Norman Julian 26th Dec
Uncharted territory! These interior trimmers which there are a few need something to hang on to so because I made them a little different the brackets they hang on to are in different places then they were originally.
Remember I have replaced a lot of the frame work so there isn't much to go on.
The other thing I did was to fix the left hand rear wheel arch because it went out past the door pillar.
I did notice it some time ago and put it in the too hard basket.
Because I had been working in this area I thought it was time to rectify the problem.
Now that it is done, the whole bus is as what it used to be.




Gregor Neil Robertson
It seems that there is nothing which is too hard for you to tackle!
Certainly looks very clean and neat.
What welding methods do you favour?
Our practice by the way is never to leave welding to the end of the day.
We never weld an hour or two before we lock up for the night.
Norman Julian
I use a mig.
Why by the way have you this practice about no welding an hour or so before the end of the day?
James Webb
My guess would be fire risk?
Norman Julian
If it was made by humans in the first place it can be fixed by humans.
Norman Julian 27th Dec
Because this area was replaced through damage that was badly repaired and some really bad rust, redesigning was done including the battery cables as was discussed before.
I decided to put an inspection panel here so as to see if anything at any time requires a routine inspection.
The side panel here on the left on the bulkhead used to go behind the top half of the battery box but now it doesn't which meant a panel replacement.




Norman Julian 27th Dec
A trial fit for this seat.
Because of the changes the holes in the frame of the seat don't lign up with the corresponding holes in the top part of the battery box so more work needed, but this time I will redrill and weld 4 studs coming up from underneath and then the seat frame can be bolted down onto them.




Gregor Neil Robertson
Ah seats! Now you’re getting somewhere!
I suggest you put a tartan covering on them!
I’ve started saving for my flight over for the Bus Warming ceremony.
Norman Julian
Tartan! That's only for Scotts.
Hang on. LOL
Norman Julian
Here we go Gregor Neil Robertson, this might be more to your liking. LOL
Gregor Neil Robertson
Well you’re likely to have some Scots in your ancestry.
I’m sure half of my rascal ancestors got transported!
Norman Julian 27th Dec

Norman Julian
Contemplating cutting the back part of the seat frame, so you can have full access to the battery box.
If it's bolted down it's not needed.
Norman Julian 30 Dec
What do you think!
Repair or replace.
This is all that is left of the original timber on this bus.
It is the battery box hatch door.
There is a lot more work in repairing.
Your thoughts please!

James Webb
It all depends on whether you can see it or not I suppose.
It's probably a bit like the name plate, you don't want to "restore" it too much as it adds character.
I'd give it a quick spruce up and see how it fits in, just don't spend hours on it.
Charles Shipway
Norman I would replace it.
My self with water proof ply and have a brand new start in life like so many other parts of the bus and could also save some time for another little project
Most of all keep up the good work mate.
Robert Bothwell
It would be nice to have one piece of original timber left on the bus.
Gregor Neil Robertson
✔️��
Catherine Norman
The test is if it aint broken don't replace it.
Old timber ages well as long as it isn't rotten and it looks sound to me.
Clean it up and sand it. New timber isn't what it used to be!
Geoff Jones
be easier to replace it .....but if you want to keep it original & the timber is still solid i would restore the timber.......
Brian Blunt
A good clean up, maybe some filler in the cracks/chips; it will look like new.
James Leonard Garrod
Would it be possible to make a new door/cover out of a thin ply or mdf and attach the old timber over it?
I really like the look of the old timber cover.
Gregor Neil Robertson
Looks a bit rough.
As the bus left the coachbuilder.
I’d leave it but clean it up a bit.
Another question -
I’m at the window glass stage with mine and have new rubbers.
I’ve watched the techniques on youtube.
They make it look easy but in my experience you need terribly strong fingers and the skill.
Do you fit your windows yourself?
And old glass gets brittle and seems very heavy.
Do you get a lighter modern glass product cut?
Greg Scott
My theory on most of the old bits is if they are in fairly good nic keep as much as you can original !
I guess there is a formula but time versus cost of material versus how well seen something is versus how much everything around it is original !
That piece looking pretty good and sitting under the seat i would give it a once over and keep it !
Catherine Norman
I've made a big mistake on our windows on AEC regal 3416 and painted in the screws in hindsight it would have been better have removed each screw first and painted the retaining panels that hold the glass in then put the screws back in.
I now have an impossible task if I need to replace the glass food for thought
Norman Julian
I think I am understanding what you are saying Cath. Put a photo up so I can see please.
David Griffiths Original is more precious than new. Thats why they havent redone the tower of London
Norman Julian 30th Dec
I ended up deciding to restore the old hatch door.
I concentrated on the first half and stripped everything off it and started sanding it till I decided that it was taking too long so I put it through my planer/thicknesser.
Then the bog was used.
I then replaced the 2 key locks with 2 NOS ones I had and put it back together for fitting in to place.
There is still a bit of work to be done before I give it my tick but at least it gets to be used again.




Peter Velthuis
NO!! You mentioned the bog word.
Norman Julian
Sorry Peter! I meant to say body enhancement
Norman Julian 31 Dec
Last job for 2017.
The other half of the hatch lid.
It is hard finding slot head screws so I recycled the old ones which weren't too bad.
I just took all the surface rust off them.
You can see the 2 halves of the hatch in position and with the key the lid can be locked.







Gregor Neil Robertson Very tidy and businesslike.
Norman Julian 31st Dec
I just want to say Happy New Year to all my facebook friends and non friends that are following this group.
This is the end of the 6th year I have been at this and hope to get things moving along in the next year.
Restoring this 31 seater has had its moments but fortunately most of the time it has been enjoyable.
Thanks again.
I would also like to mention that there is another 31 seater being restored at the same time as this and like this it is very extensive.
Who would have thought that in 2017, 2, 31 seaters would have a ground up restoration.
I'm sure Greg Scott wouldn't mind others watching his progress.
Greg Scott
happy new year norm !
its been a great year restoring 2661 and sharing the progress with the group and likwise its been fantastic following youre good work and progress !
nice to have a little laugh and chat along the way as well and share a common interest !
for anyone who would like to join my group that has an interest are more than welcome just punch in restoration of daimler bus 2661 and ask to join the group and i will happily add you !
all the best norm for 2018 to you and youre family keep up the great work mate !
Norman Julian
You too Greg and don't let fly the body filla story or you may not see a new year. LOL
Greg Scott
norm i might add a brickies trowel to that story and really push my luck ? lol
Robert Bothwell
Happy New Year Norman.
Norman Julian
You too Roberto.
Charles Shipway
Norman Julian Happy new year while you keep us informed on the restoration life is good It will be good to look over the progress when it is finished and thanks for the regular updates the day will come the job will be finished
Then Time To drive her with your head held high
Norman Julian
Thanks Charles same to you. You are one of the few who just about likes every photo I put up. Thanks again for your following.
Brian King
Happy New Year Norm ....should be a good one
Norman Julian
Thanks Brian. Same with you. We all hope it is a good one
Brian Blunt
It has been most enjoyable following your progress during the year.
All the best for 2018
Norman Julian
Glad you have enjoyed it. I aim to please!
Peter Velthuis
Happy new year to you Norm.
Norman Julian
You too old son!
Peter Velthuis
Norman Julian yea i know.
Old school tha
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