Norms Restoration - 31 Seater Projects & Leyland TD 5 Project

1939 Leyland TD5 [1635 DD]

2018

Elec February

Norman Julian 1st Feb
Fiddled with the electricals today and got all the lights working and the photos don't show it but it looks brilliant at night and really bright inside.




Phil Belak
Looks very cool.
Steve Hardie
Brilliant
James Leonard Garrod
It ain't Halloween yet......turn 'em back orf!
Peter Velthuis
I can see the light.��
James Leonard Garrod
Be my guest - go towards it....
Norman Julian
You are showing signs Pete! LOL
Norman Julian
Does anyone know whether period 12 volts globes are available.
The ones that are in the bus are modern.
I was told that they are hard to get these days.
James Leonard Garrod
Norm, can you text me (0410 65 7259) a photo and list specs (easier to see than sorting through farcebook posts) of the bulbs.
I'm going to a big swap meet next week and there is a bloke who always turns up that specialises in old and/or repro bulbs -
I'll show him and get his details for you.
(I might earn a few Idiot credits....)
Charles Shipway
Looks great with the lights on
Lee Hall
Awesome
David Griffiths
that's surprising! mine has only three 12volt, 15 watt lamps each side downstairs.
Has yours been converted to 24 volt?
Norman Julian
No! 12 volt
Graeme Knappick 3rd Feb
1635 at night!




Norman Julian 5th Feb
This is the very first job I am doing on the TD5.
These are the headlights obviously.
I wont say anything except this.
Never ever use silicone when restoring.
Just about everything on these lights was sliconed together.
Some of the results of using this stuff is apparent.




Norman Julian
YUK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



Norman Julian
These reflectors have been rechromed.
Saves me doing it.
Lorie Norton
Petrol will help dissolve the silicon if that helps.
Urs Mueller 5th Feb
Hello Norman
Got them lights about 25 years ago of a D/D bus in the NT.
Are they original equipment?



Norman Julian
They are off nothing I have seen mate but that is nothing to go by.
David Wilson
1635 would have had these brand new Norm !
Replaced in 1941 by the current arrangement
Norman Julian
Wow !
That's interesting
Norman Julian
I would like to see a bulb out of these though!
Scott Wilson
Same as post war.
Norman Julian
Maybe! Maybe not.
They may still have the original bulbs.
Urs Mueller
Norman do you like a picture of my headlight globes?
Norman Julian
Urs Mueller
If it is not too much trouble.
The socket as well please.
Urs Mueller







Norman Julian
Thanks Urs.
That's what I thought it may look like.
Maybe original, maybe not but looks much better than mine.
Norman Julian
These are post war types.
Norman Julian 6th Feb
I have a few of these glass surrounds and as you can see the paint has covered up little rust holes.
In the past I just went through my stocks to find suitable replacements but now I can easily repair them with solder.
Norman Julian 6th Feb
Half the job of these headlights is done.
These had replacement plastic 12 volt sockets placed in the reflector and smothered with silicone to hold it all together because one didn't suit the other.
This is because the lighting system in these prewars was apparently 12 volt and was converted some time after to 24 volt the 12 volt fittings have gone by the dinosaurs.
I have plenty of 24 volt sockets and bulbs that I will convert everything over to 24 volt.
The old girl as you can see now has eyes.








Norman Julian
It didn't take much for this round bracket to come off.

Norman Julian
Ready to be welded back on

Norman Julian
After a little panelbeating this bucket looks OK again.

Norman Julian
This is how this bracket looked before I took the round base bracket off.
Norman Julian
I replaced the original screws with these socket screws.
I had to re tap the brass bracket to take the different size socket.
Fred Holland
Looks great Norm. Great job
Norman Julian
Thanks Fred.
These have got to be the easiest headlights to do anything with that I have be associated with.
John Swadling
No chance you could get this lovely bus to Gnoo Blas Car Show Orange 17th February to park next to Albert
Norman Julian
None whatsoever John.
The blown head gasket caused her to have no power.
When Graeme drove her backwards she couldn't even get over the dip in the gutter ajoining the 2 roads.
Norman Julian 8th Feb
Attention David Griffiths!
The next time you go to the museum could you take a shot of your fuse box please.
I want to know the right era switch so I can get them all the same on this one.
Thanks.
David Griffiths
Identical.
No photo needed!
It may come as a brief surprise but you have to slide the fuse up 1cm. to pull it out.
All looks very healthy though.
Norman Julian
That's not what I mean.
If you look at it there are 4 different style switches.
I want to get them all the same.
David Griffiths
Aaaah...
Manage
Norman Julian
This is what the AEC was like
Norman Julian
This is it now.
All the switches are the same.
1952 is easy. 1939 is hard.
Nothing to go by.
David Griffiths
Good question.
I rebuilt mine using switches gleaned from a friend who rewired his house in Berrima.
I used the best matching ones that emerged.
I suspect the far LHS type is original and not all that durable, so was replaced by the more button-shaped variety.
The AEC board is not applicable being 14 years younger.
You may be able to tell by removing the switches and looking at the drillings for the mounting screw holes.
The fewer holes, the more original the switch.
Norman Julian
I was just using that to make a point.
The switches are too modern for 39.
I agree with you but there are others there I have never seen before
Philip Tumber
Norman Julian the switches may have been changed at 1635's last overhaul.
As they were common Australian (HPM ?) 240V 10A light and power switches for internal use, the hostile environment of a motor bus could have shortened the switch life.
Fuses could even be 240V types.
David Griffiths
I'll photograph mine but its not necessarily historically accurate: just effective.
I do think your TD far LHS switch is original.
memory of being in old houses tells me so...
But it depends on Clipsal or HPM as being mfrs.
I still have spares left over from the matching process.
Norman Julian
Do you still use 12 watt globes in yours.
The ones in this have modern small bayonet fittings which are wrong. Not sure what to do here.
I could change the whole thing over to 24 volt.
Have plenty of sockets to suit 24 volt but not 12 volt
David Griffiths
For 24 v. you have to change everything.
Dynamo, regulator, battery connections, everything except the starter.
Tricky.
A few UK operators did it.
I have quite a few 12v.
15 watt bulbs gleaned from a supplier in SA, thanks to Dick Clarke of STM.
But you need very shallow sockets and deep fishbowls to accommodate them. Fun Fun. Sydney Tram lamp sockets from the 1910s - 1920s suit the TDs.
I have a few leftovers.
I'll send you the 24 - 12 volt changeover switch diagram and my wiring diagram for the TD.
Norman Julian
I am working on the headlights at the moment and have converted them over to 24 volt.
The system with the headlights are different to yours because yours are period.
I'm sticking with the later conversion that was done on them with the bar across the front that had the lights on that. The headlight bowls are best suitable for the 24 volt fittings.
Norman Julian
Question
Did the 12 volts system have the large bayonet or small bayonet
David Griffiths
yes but your battery voltage isn't.
Everything is 12v except the starter.
Alastair may not have been across all this....
The large cylindrical starter switch behind the drivers right leg changes batt wiring to 24v.
for starting, 12 v for all else.
Unless your is a rare bird that has 24 v dynamo and batteries you need to stick with 12 v.
Maybe come to museum and see mine and TD5 1438,
David Griffiths
second question:
both used large bayonet.
no way to tell except by testing resistance.
Norman Julian
I have all this plastic rubbish in each light with these modern small bayonet globes.
Totally not acceptable.
The same with the headlights
David Griffiths
here is my drawing of how the Bosch starter switch works. The plan relies on two batteries, connected in parallel for lighting/charging and in series for starting.
It took me hours of sweat and experiment to figure it out.
The Leyland book is not much help but I can lend it to you for photocopying
Norman Julian
I did see a wiring diagram out in the manual that Alistair gave me maybe it is this
Norman Julian
Looking at the photos that Alistair gave me I'm betting there were no globes in any of the lights and Alistair converted them over by cutting off the old light fittings and putting these modern plastic fittings on.
He did mention that the 12 volt globes are next to impossible to find
Norman Julian 10th Feb
I made myself a promise that both Leylands weren't going to be like the AEC.
(example time spent) Well looks like I have broken it already.
Anyway, I have completely finished the first job for the Titan.
Since the last photos I put up of these lights I completely stripped off all the paint on the bowls and face panels and found little rust pin holes under the paint.
I dealt with that and rust converted the both of them and put 2 coats of undercoat as well as 2 coats of top coat.
The electrics was also done.
New wiring etc. All the bakelite fittings were taken apart.
The brass fittings were cleared of years of dirt that could interfere with how it works etc.
Even the bakelite was polished up as I did with all the AEC fittings.
I will leave the lights on the bus for now to let the paint cure.
It goes really hard like 2 pak paint the longer you leave it.








Lee Hall
Have you ever started with the crank handle?
Norman Julian
No and I don't think you can.
To be honest I don't think that is what is does.
Lee Hall
Really?
What is it for?
Heard a story from a bloke I know used to work on old trucks.
He reckons they used to wrap a length of rope around the handle and three of them pulled the rope to start.
Haha
Norman Julian
With the aid of a lever near the front of the engine you can release the pressure from the valves and you can rotate the engine and it makes it easier to prime the fuel system which is gravity feed.
If the batteries are a little undercharge you can assist the kickover by rotating the lever while someone is in the cab kicking it over.
Norman Julian
There is no way on a new engine when there is full compression that any one person has the strength to hand crank over an engine this size.
Last updated
February 2018
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